THIS WAS UPDATED ON JULY 25 2021
AFTER A RECAP OF HOW THIS IDEA DEVELOPED AMONG SEVERAL CONTRIBUTORS, YOU WILL FIND A CLEAR AND STRAIGHTFORWARD DESCRIPTION OF THIS DVAR TORAH AS IT SHOULD BE PRESENTED TO AN AUDIENCE. IT IS VERY, VERY, VERY, GOOD.
In last year's post on this parsha, I brought a Medrash (cited by the Taz) that says that the reason Mila is on the eighth day, and the reason an animal cannot be brought as a korban till the eighth day after its birth, is that they must experience the passage of Shabbos. Only then, only having been elevated by the Kedusha of Shabbos, can they be used in the service of the Ribono shel Olam.
In as perfect an example of stimulating collaboration as one could hope for, the comments that came in developed an outstanding vort. I had a Medrash, Eli brought up a question on the Medrash, I brought a Chasam Sofer that answers the question but I didn't understand the svara of the Chasam Sofer, then I suggested a possible approach, and great unknown provided a conceptual framework that sheds light upon the entire discussion. This is how it unfolded, followed by a recap.
Eli wrote...A bit off topic, but this Medrash had me long wondering - why the 8th day. Had Bris been the 7th day, Shabbos would also be always included. If you think that the answer is we need a full 24h Shabbos, think again. What if a baby is born Shabbos afternoon and the Bris is in the morning?
March 31, 2011 11:18 AM
I responded...(.....)The Chasam Sofer in his Teshuvos OC 102, dealing with the opinion (of the Italian Mekubalim) that kiddush levana should be at least seven days after the molad, brings in our Medrash. He addresses your point, and says that evidently, the bris, or the idea of Pnei Matronisa, requires two things: Experiencing the beginning of a Shabbos, and experiencing the end of a Shabbos: כניסת מטרוניתא ויציאת מטרוניתא.
From the formal logic perspective, his answer is fine. From the "why on earth would that make sense" perspective, nu nu.
March 31, 2011 11:52 AM
I added...I was thinking about what I said, that it's hard to see a svara in what the Chasam Sofer said, and here's what occurred to me.
The din of זכרהו בכניסתו וביציאתו, to make some sort of kiddush when Shabbos begins and when it ends, pashtus, is a simple din of kavod- like saluting an honored guest when he arrives and when he leaves. But it is possible that there is one particular kedusha that happens at the onset and another at the conclusion of Shabbos. It's not just Hello and Goodbye.
Even the shittos that hold not like the Rambam, who hold that havdala is entirely miderabanan, don't necessarily disagree with the concept, they just hold that there's no din kiddush on yetzias Shabbos.
March 31, 2011 12:48 PM
great unknown said...Kenisas HaShabbos signals the categorical distinction of the Jew from the mundane non-Jewish residents of creation. Yetzias HaShabbos signals a lower level of kedusha which involves Jews being involved in the everyday "la'sheves" of the world - while nevertheless being quantitatively superior to the non-Jew in kedusha - ner la'amim if you will.
Both are necessary elements of the Jewish interaction with and purpose in creation.
I am basing this on a brilliant drosho I heard last Succos in KJBS/Chicago, which covered many more details of this dual havdalah.
March 31, 2011 5:36 PM
Eli said...In the Shalom Zachar of my second, I (unaware of the Chasam Sofer) suggested that the requirement is to experience Shabbos-night davka. This fits nicely with the fact we observe Shalom Zachar Friday night, a time when people are usually not going out (and that specific night was bitterly cold, btw).
I'm sure gu can explain much better than myself why the מטרוניתא aspect of Shabbos is related to the night part and not the day. One pointer is Ramban Shmos 20:7 which I quote verbatim for lack of unerstanding: "ובמדרשו של רבי נחוניא בן הקנה (ספר הבהיר אות קפב): הזכירו עוד סוד גדול בזכור ושמור, ועל הכלל תהיה הזכירה ביום והשמירה בלילה, וזהו מאמר החכמים (ב"ק לב ב): שאומרים בערב שבת באי כלה באי כלה, באו ונצא לקראת שבת מלכה כלה, ויקראו לברכת היום קדושא רבא (פסחים קו א): שהוא הקדוש הגדול, ותבין זה. "
So whatever that means, the feminine aspect of שבת which is called מלכה, i.e. מטרוניתא, relates to the night, not the day.
To complete the Drush I said that we see the feminine aspect of שבת is related to שמור and not זכור, i.e. the passive acceptance of Kedusha, as opposed to our active efforts represented by the Zachor part. As we prepare for giving our newborn the message of R. Akiva (Tanchuma Tazria), that his deeds could achieve greater results than those of Hashem, so to speak, we first need to go through the Shamor part, to recall it's all based on the Kedusha we get from above, passively.
April 01, 2011 3:18 AM
UPDATE MAY 5, 2014:
I got an email today from Lakewood Guy, who just made a bris, and he used this Chasam Sofer and added two excellent things:
The meforshim ask why the mitzvah of shmittah is prefaced by shesh shanim tizra...
It is relatively easy to have an awareness of being involved in avodas Hashem during the shana hasheviis. The trick is, maintaining that awareness during the shesh shanim of zeriia.
Here I used your pshat in the medrash/ chasam sofer - the child must experience a motzai shabbos to realize that avodas Hashem is not limited to shabbos but must permeate the sheshes yimai hama'aseh as well.
Bach in hilchos teffilah (O"C 133) Aleinu is said after teffilah to prepare ourselves for dealing with the outside world. Minhag is to say Aleinu after a bris (seemingly even when the bris is not at the end of a teffilah). Same idea, preparing the child for life outside, with an awareness that even the mundane aspects of life need to be a part of ones avodas Hashem.
Organized into one coherent piece:
The Medrash says that a child has to undergo a Shabbos before his bris. (This is common to many applications in Kodashim: All the original kohanim before their investiture; the Kohen Gadol before Yom Kippur; the kohen that does the Parah Adumah; and, of course, every animal korban. The Abudraham says that the Bris Milah is really a form of hakravas Korban, so it is just another application of this rule of Kodashim.)
The Chasam Sofer (Tshuvos OC 102) asks, why do you need to wait for the eighth day? Even waiting for the seventh day will mean that he saw a Shabbos! So he explains as follows, modified by me for purposes of speaking to a rabbim:
If the purpose of the eight days is to ensure that the baby experience Shabbos, seven days should be good enough.
· If he was born on Shabbos, and the bris is on Friday, he saw Shabbos - he saw the second half, the end, of Shabbos.
· If he was born Sunday, and you make the bris on Shabbos morning, he saw Shabbos - he saw the whole beginning of Shabbos, Friday night and the morning before the bris.
· Do not say that the requirement to wait for the eighth day is because he has to have 24 hours of Shabbos, because if he's born Shabbos afternoon, and the bris is Shabbos morning, he only will have had fourteen hours out of twenty four of Shabbos!
· So the Chasam Sofer answers that what the child needs is not 24 hours of Shabbos. What he needs is to experience the beginning of a Shabbos and the departure of a Shabbos.
This answer is difficult to understand. It answers the question perfectly, but it leaves us with more questions that we began with - explaining something perplexing with an answer that is more perplexing. Why would it matter if the child experiences both the beginning and the end of a Shabbos? Is there something special about the end of Shabbos? Isn't the beginning enough?
Another question:
Many people say that Tuma comes when Kedusha leaves. The Shem Mishmuel asks, if so, why is there no tuma when Shabbos ends?
Perhaps the idea of the departure of Shabbos is reflected in the halacha of Havdala. We are not merely saying goodbye to Shabbos, but instead we are being mekadeish a different type of kedusha, the kedusha of after-Shabbos. great unknown polished this by saying that the kedusha of Shabbos, which we celebrate in Friday night kiddush, is the kedusha of olam haba, of being above Teva. The kedusha of Saturday night, the kedusha of Havdala, is the kedusha of living in a world of teva, of working, of interacting with the gentile world, and all through it making the world a holier place.
This is why the departure of Shabbos does not result in an influx of Tumah. Tumah only follows the departure of kedusha when nothing is left behind. The point of Havdala is that when Shabbos ends, and the kedusha leaves, it leaves some of itself behind to be mekadesh the forthcoming week. Havdala is a type of kiddush.
It is those two kedushos that are implicit in the Medrash that are essential to being a Jew. (See Ksav Sofer at end.)
Perhaps you could say that the beginning of Shabbos is the gift of kedusha, the feminine aspect of Klal Yisrael vis a vis Shabbos, when we receive the gift of Kedusha. On Friday night, we receive kedusha, a kedusha that is the source of all kedusha in this gashmiyuskikkeh world. When Shabbos ends, we experience Shabbos in the masculine aspect; we are told to take what we experienced and apply it in the world of Gashmiyus, we are told to disseminate kedusha.
This reminded me of something that happened in my own extended family. X was going through a very challenging teen age period, and Y was considering hanging out with him motzei Shabbos, not for kiruv, just to chill out. One of my sons told Y "The same way you wouldn't be mechallel Shabbos, make sure that you're not mechallel motzei Shabbos."
This idea is perfectly suited for presenting at the Seuda of a Bris. Targum Yonasan by "Be'cha yevareich Yisrael" says that specifically at the Seudas HaBris Klal Yisrael will bentch their children by saying ישימך אלוקים כאפרים וכמנשה. It powerfully expresses the two important aspects of what the Bris Millah is supposed to symbolize and to strengthen, of what it means to be an eved Hashem: the kedusha of l'maalah min hateva, and the kedusha of teva. The Jew of Sheishes yamim ta'aseh me'lachtecha, and the Jew of Shabbos la'Shem Elokecha. Be a Malach; and Be a Mentsch.
A great talmid chacham to whom I told this said it over in his yeshiva, but he said a different pshat in the Chasam Sofer/Medrash. He said that the lesson of יציאת מטרוניתא is that a Jew has to be ready for change. It's relatively easy to maintain a high madreiga during the zman, no matter how long the zman is. But when Bein Hazmanim comes, not everyone can deal with the change. A child has to learn that a Jew has to be able to tolerate change, to adjust to what is dealt to him.
The Ksav Sofer in Teshuvos OC 45, here, beginning at the end of the fifteenth line, in his explanation of the Gemara in Pesachim 113a המבדיל על היין במוצ״ש מאי היא דמשייר מקידושא לאבדלתא, says something very similar to our pshat in Havdala, which works so well to explain his father's mehalach.
As far as משייר מקידושא לאבדלתא, the Tur (OC 296) brings this Gemara too. that a person should leave wine over from kiddush and use it for Havdala. We don't have this minhag, because Tosfos learns the Gemara differently, but the Shulchan Aruch Harav brings it down in OC 271:22.) In any case, the Tur there is very emphatic about the importance of Havdala and brings strong words to that effect from Pirkei D'Rebbi Eliezer.
AND ADDING LAKEWOOD GUY'S IDEA-
In parshas Behar, the meforshim ask why the mitzvah of shmittah is prefaced by shesh shanim tizra.
It is relatively easy to have an awareness of being involved in avodas Hashem during the shana hasheviis. The trick is, maintaining that awareness during the shesh shanim of zeriia.
The answer is that we learn from our Chasam Sofer that the lesson of waiting eight days before a Bris Millah is that the child must experience a Motzai Shabbos to realize that avodas Hashem is not limited to Shabbos but must permeate the sheshes yimai hama'aseh as well.
The Bach in hilchos teffilah (O"C 133) says that we say Aleinu after teffilah to prepare ourselves for dealing with the outside world. We also have a minhag to say Aleinu after a bris (seemingly even when the bris is not at the end of a tefilah, and even though we just said Aleinu five minutes ago!). This is the same idea; we are preparing the child to receive kedusha, and we are preparing the child to disseminate the kedusha he received. We give him a physical mark that imparts the awareness that even the mundane aspects of life need to be a part of ones avodas Hashem.
